Science or Religion

We had a talk on Sunday. A talk = sermon for you non JWs.
It was so full of crappy logic, I'll lightly go over the topics spoken about.

The gist was do Not put your hope in science put it in God.
a) Scientist can be/are bad have lied before.
b) Science has brought about bad things
c) evolution is propoganda
d) bible was in agreement with science and supported 1)round earth , 2)water cycle, and 3)cleanliness 4) order of creation was explained in simple terms.
e) true science,(what the heck is that?) and archological evidence supports the bible
f) man wont bring about living forever and god will

Except for B and D he really didn't go into detail and just slung it. What an ass.

Well in correlating responses
a) All "people" can be bad
b) people do bad things.
c) I'd like to get into this in more detail later but for now since he just took a swipe at it with no backing I'll take a simliar swipe, Religion is propoganda.
d) I've seen proposals that actually support flat earth from the bible, the water cycle thing was not in detail so it takes a bit of a jump , I'm glad they burried their crap, and No there are countering/contradictory views on the bibles creation order. And lastly , some things are bound to be right some of the time, how about the times it's wrong?
e)Not all the time, I would have to go bring some items up , which he failed to do. So I'll just say sometimes and sometimes not.
f) We can actually see man trying we can't see god trying.


But back to point B) becuase he brought out that "science" has brought about landmines as an example and that yet science has not come up with a safe way to remove them and currently people just use a stick to poke and leverage up for how its being done and so often get killed trying to get rid of them. Utter bullocks, yes some do that but also there are also now robots that can be used to disarm mines and no one need die. A more importantly it was "man" that made them with the knowledge that science gave him. Don't blame the knoweldge blame man.



I really don't know yet that I think it's good to try to make 2 sides to a fence with science on one side and religion or spirituality on the other. It is good to know when ones actions are based upon "feelings" and reasoning or logic and reasoning or a mixture of both.

I do think though that science and logic can be used as a good measuring stick on how the physical world works and how we can react and live within it.

Faith is a stinky word.

The word Faith bugs me. A different word should be picked. Perhaps feelings, belief, knowledge, evidence, or credulity, depending on your definition.

Definition 1 (JWs):
"Faith is the assured expectation of things hoped for, the evident demonstration of realities though not beheld," (Hebrews 11:1) and Faith is also “the evident demonstration,” or evidence for conviction, regarding unseen things. Our mental perception and heart appreciation convince us that such things are real, although we have not seen them.—2 Corinthians 5:7; Ephesians 1:18.
http://www.watchtower.org/e/20020401/article_01.htm
http://www.watchtower.org/e/20031201/article_02.htm
The Insight Book(green JW book) even goes so far as to say it's concrete evidence. that evidence being.
1) Creation- The universe and world around us
2) Bible is accurate and true word of God
3) Jesus's Life story
4) Prophsey proved accurate

So this definition is coming from the angle of absolutes, or I have facts or I think I have facts that prove my belief. Basically its saying, even though I got these invisible/blind spots I have so much surrounding evidence that I can be confident I am right.

Needless to say I've seen counter arguments to many so called evidences including the ones above which I'll blog about later.

Once you subtract those evidences you no longer have faith based upon evidence but now come to definition 2 of faith.
That being of a concept for a gap filler, In the absence of facts it is a feelings thing or faith in faith or a personal experience thing. To me this is a bit of a cop out and a crutch, a hole in your argument, sometimes willful ignorance, it is abdicating your head for your feelings.

I really don't much like the word faith , it now has alot of negative connotations to me.

If you happen to have faith, wether it be definition 1 or 2, I don't mind as long as you don't do assholeish things because of it.

If you are a JW and reading this blog

If you are following the direction of the society , read no further, while I'm not vehemently against the religion I would now be considered "worldly" or "bad association"(edit: apostate -was removed) because I'm actually going to voice my opinion out loud. So read no further if you are trying to follow the societies advice and stop looking around the internet. This surely is not going to build up your faith. So do as advised and please go bury your head in the sand.

I decided that for myself if my faith/belief system couldn't stand an assault from anything then it wasn't a worthy belief system.